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All(most) of the new back/tenon saws I see for sale set up as Cross Cut saws

Welcome! Forums General Woodworking Discussions Tools and Tool Maintenance/Restoration All(most) of the new back/tenon saws I see for sale set up as Cross Cut saws

Viewing 15 posts - 1 through 15 (of 18 total)
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  • #142430
    drwillie
    Member

    I REALLY need a proper back saw as all I have now is a medium quality “Gent’s Saw” and a piece-of-crap Stanley that came with a 20 dollar Home Depot miter box.

    It seems that all of the new back saws I see for sale are filed for cross cutting, easy enough to change with what I’ve learned from Paul but why are all these saws filed for cross cutting in the first place? It seems that almost all the work done with a tenon/back saw is ripping of some sort or another. Even in cutting tenons, the only cross cut saw cut is the cutting of the shoulders of the tenon.

    Am I missing something> Why are all these saws set up for cross cutting and not ripping?

    • This topic was modified 3 years ago by drwillie.
    • This topic was modified 3 years ago by drwillie.
    #142434
    David Perrott
    Participant

    You know I have wondered that too. When I first started out I got the Veritas cross and rip carcass saws. I did work that way for a while. I personally don’t see much difference between the 2 in my work. I guess because the tpi is very close. Sometimes I think its good to experiment and try different techniques. I have been meaning to go back to the cross and rip, but I’m lazy and just use the rip. I could (you too) just use the rip saw and be fine. They are nice saws. I don’t use them too much because I have some vintage saws that have a bit more weight to them that I prefer. I am tempted by those tenon saws which are ugly or so ugly they are cool but the last thing I need is more saws. Lastly I prefer the gents saw for dovetails.

    #142435
    David B
    Participant

    I imagine (and I’m totally guessing) that your average dude using a saw is probably chopping wood, not cutting dovetails by hand, and thus maybe a cross-cut is a default pattern for the most common uses of said saw, even if it defies logic.

    #142438
    drwillie
    Member

    I can see that if the saws were from a big box home center, but these are all “high dollar”, (high pound?) saws from woodworking specialty stores such as, (here in North America), Woodcraft, Veritas, Garrett Wade and similar. Anyone spending 100-250 bucks on a saw I’d think was doing at least SOME kind of fine woodworking and not just whacking the ends off of 2x4s.

    Will

    • This reply was modified 3 years ago by drwillie.
    #142449
    drwillie
    Member

    After watching the Bow Saw episodes for a second time. I’m thinking that this might be the way to go anyway. Looks like a fun project. I have Tage Frid’s books and, as I recall, a bow saw was all he used anyway.

    Will

    #142694
    drwillie
    Member

    Anybody else care to “chime in”?

    #143004
    Raff Uy
    Participant

    Not sure if will help, but did you try Ebay? I’m from the Philippines and a good tenon/backsaw is almost none existence. I decided to buy from Ebay UK. The choices are so many and quality ones too. I don’t know if the piece I’m buying is rip or crosscut until it arrived, but it’s very easy to change the tooth pattern from crosscut to rip or vise versa.

    #143012
    David B
    Participant

    The frame saw/bow saw is easy to make and is a fun project. And it works very well (and you can even change the blades in it as you see fit). My only gripe on mine is that, while it is fine for cutting, it can be a bit unwieldy for some of my more detailed work. But it is a turbo powered saw for sure.

    #143013
    jcat
    Participant

    I have a veritas 20tpi dovetail saw which I use of most of my work however sometimes I need something a little bigger. I made a frame saw 14″ at the blade hole centers using Pauls recommended 14tpi metal cutting bandsaw blade and I can tell I’ll never buy a tenon saw again, it’s terrific. It does take a little getting used to comming from a back saw but not alot. I also modified mine to be a turning saw, well worth while IMO.
    Cheers

    #143014
    Hugo Notti
    Participant

    Making a frame saw was one of my first projects, when I started woodworking again. You have to get used to the handling, but it is no surprise, that this type of saw is the preferred saw in some parts of the world (Germany, France, Switzerland, Austria, Czechia and many more places). You can still buy these saws here, but rip-cut blades are rare too. Fortunately, there is a big variety of bandsaw blades available!

    Dieter

    #143015
    David Perrott
    Participant

    I made the bow saw and found it be tough to use at first. The blade was pretty aggressive and hard to start. I used the blade he blogged about. I think I put it in the oven for a while and then relaxed the rake a bit and it made it easier to use. I was thinking about making a smaller version, because as stated, I also find it hard to use for finer work. I did use it to cut through 3 inch maple to make my mallet and it was fantastic. I was thinking about making another one of Paul’s but much smaller, based on tools for working wood version. I would use the same blade I already have. I don’t want a turning saw but more of a joinery bow saw.

    If I do it again, for the curves I will use a compass instead of a “bean can” for the curves. Maybe it was the can I used, but I had trouble reproducing the curve. Maybe would make a template also of the curve. Something I could easily reproduce the curve.

    I just sharpened my dovetail saws, glad I don’t have that 20tpi veritas. That gets hard to see!

    #143016
    jcat
    Participant

    Yep, I adjusted the set on the band saw blade as per Pauls instruction/video between two hammers, worked well for me.
    I haven’t had to sharpen my Veritas yet but with 20tpi I’m not looking foward to it but I have got a clip on magnifing glass ordered on ebay, maybe that will help.
    Cheers

    #143017
    David Perrott
    Participant

    What may help is dykem layout fluid. Just paint it on.Then you can see what tooth you did, and if you get the red color, it looks like blood! The problem I had is I had to set the saws. They had no set and would bind in the cut. That was hard to see, when you are skipping each other tooth.

    #143019
    drwillie
    Member

    I’m going to make the frame saw for sure. What saw(s) to get and where to get them is not my question.

    My question is why are so many of the new back/tenon saws I see for sale are set up for cross cutting, even though most of the work they do is ripping.

    #143020
    David Perrott
    Participant

    I don’t understand your statement. Where are you talking about? Most manufactures sell saws in both configurations and not just cross cut. They are tool makers, they want to sell their tools so they will offer both. It really depends on the work you do and how you work. Maybe you don’t need it in a cross but someone will.

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