Dovetail technique questions
Welcome! / Forums / Project Series / Dovetail Boxes / Dovetail technique questions
- This topic has 6 replies, 5 voices, and was last updated 8 years, 8 months ago by kevinjames.
-
AuthorPosts
-
19 July 2015 at 6:11 pm #128611
I’ve been practicing making dovetails following Paul’s instructions in the dovetail box video series. I’ve done it about 9 or 10 times now simply trying to get the joint right and I’m seeing some improvements for sure but there are a few things that I haven’t been able to figure out yet by trial and error and was hoping I could get some pointers.
First is that I’m having a really hard time getting a tight fit without splitting the outside corner. (see photo) If I try to remove ‘just a little more’ material to make it fit there is a gap. Also if I try to fit the joint I’ve been noticing it doesn’t take all that much pressure to split it usually it happens when I’m just pushing the two together without any sort of mallet persuasion to fit the two. So I don’t know the difference between a good tight fit and a too big fit until it is too late and it splits.
The second part is more of a technique one and it has to do with making the saw cut. I have a really difficult time making a straight cut without putting a slight round on the left side of the cut (I’m right handed). No matter how hard I focus on making the saw go straight forward and back it is never square across. This may just be a practice type of thing but it is frustrating none the less.
Thanks for any pointers you have!
Attachments:
You must be logged in to view attached files.19 July 2015 at 7:54 pm #128613Keep practicing, you’re doing fine!
Make sure you keep your “inside” and “outside” faces straight. If you get the tail board flipped when you fit the joint you can get a mismatch and one side may end up too tight and split. Just double check that you keep the boards matched to the same faces you marked on the pin board. I found that occasional mistake, once corrected, really reduced splits in my dovetailed joints. The rest were caused by not cutting right to the line on the pins and having it fat someplace on the pin. Just takes practice.
Dovetails can be much improved by just practicing your sawing. Put some parallel lines on a piece of scrap in your vice and just practice sawing the lines straight and square. Keep at it and it doesn’t take much practice at all to really improve.
19 July 2015 at 9:08 pm #128617Be very careful with your layout lines and practice cutting to those lines. It could be that your dovetail was a little bit “fatter” on the outside face than the inside face. This would cause a wedging effect as you drive the tail into the pins. Maybe you could measure the tails – I don’t know a god method of measuring.
As for the sawing, I’m not sure I was reading your scenario properly. Was it that as you cut down a line, you stray from the line to the left side? If so, your saw could have more set on that side and you need to remove a little bit of set by “stoning” that side. That is, rub a sharpening stone lightly along the teeth on the left side of the saw only. See if that helps.
If you were saying that you have a tough time sawing square to your work (or along your end grain layout line), then try this; put a backer board behind your workpiece, doubling the thickness you need to saw through. Extend your end grain layout lines to this backer board. Now try sawing to your lines. The extra length of the top layout lines will help you start a true cut.
Let us know how you progress.
19 July 2015 at 9:18 pm #128618Matt, thank you for your comments. Your second scenario is more like it. I think the issue is that instead of binging the saw straight back and straight forwards I think the way that I saw causes it to have the back side (closest to me) pull left a bit on the pull stroak then on the push stroak the front edge pulls a bit to the left causing a somewhat curved cut. The error is an 8th at the most probably closer to a 16th of rounding the square edge mostly near the top when the saw is starting.
I know it’s a problem but have a hard time stopping myself from doing it.
I’ll try the backer board next time I practice and that would be some help until I can do it without.
Everything you have described is what I struggle with. Cutting dovetails is about making adjustments and repetitions. Also, I have noticed, when making the dovetails fit perfectly, you want a snug fit, but, also, what looks to be a gap quickly fills in when you glue the two pieces together. Remember, the glue will swell wood fibers, so try and glue a couple pieces together and clean up the dovetails with a plane, you will be surprised on how well they turn out. Looking at your picture, I bet what looks like a gap on the left side would disappear after it has been glued together.
And another thing, when paring for a perfect fit, stay away from the outside edge, and pair from inside faces.. That will help prevent a gap from forming…
21 July 2015 at 3:47 am #128675Small update. I was practicing a bit more after reading something Paul wrote somewhere and that was to start cutting on the push stroke because on the pull stroke the teeth can sort of embed in the wood causing it to bind or whatever the right word is.
Well I’ve been noticing that I have had trouble on the push stroke it seemed more difficult than the pull stroke where it felt like the teeth were getting stuck. I think figured that since the pull stroke felt easier than to push I was light on the push and heavier on the pull which may have worsened the problem with pushing… I don’t know
So I started to focus on putting a bit more pressure (but not a huge amount) on the push stroke and letting up a bit on the pull. This has caused a major improvement in quality of cut and the ability to cut square.
This is probably obvious to most people who have done this longer than a few weeks but realizing this seems to be a breakthrough moment since my whole life I have always been frustrated hand sawing for this exact reason. Also maybe all saws aren’t like this but the way these teeth must be set means I have to use this technique.
Thanks for all your pointers I’ll keep practicing and soon I’m sure I’ll feel confident that I can cut a dovetail on two ends of a board so I can eventually put them all together in a box
14 August 2015 at 8:03 pm #129388For what it’s worth I struggle a great deal with dovetails. I started practicing on scrap. What really helped me was to take a razor knife and make sure there were absolutely no little teeny tiny fibers in the corners of both the pins and tails. Then I very slightly took off the sharp inside corners of the pins to give it some relief. Seemed to help a bunch. So you’re certainly not alone my friend.
-
AuthorPosts
- You must be logged in to reply to this topic.