free non-quick-release vice vs. non-free quick-release vise
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29 January 2014 at 3:40 pm #26810
I’m about to finally begin building my workbench and was about to place an order from Lee Valley for a new 10″ jaw quick-release bench vise here. It was this one: http://www.leevalley.com/US/wood/page.aspx?p=49980&cat=1,41659
Before making the purchase though, I remembered I had stored away in the back corner of the garage, an old Richards Wilcox woodworking vise. I had gotten it several years ago from freecycle and so it didn’t cost me a dime. I had picked it up with the intention of making a bench. This was before Paul’s site or dvds. Anyway, I checked it last night and it also has 10″ jaws, has no rust, just dirt/grime. Howewver, it is not quick-release.
Three questions:
1. How important is it to your work in the shop that your vise be quick-release?
2. Just how much of an annoyance is working wood with a non-qr vise?
3. If I do opt for the Richards Wilcox, what has been your experience for the best
method of removing old grease/grime? Soap/detergent and water or mineral spirits?My thoughts tend towards installing the old vise since the savings would be substantial $175 (£105) . On the other hand, I would be using the bench for a some time into the foreseeable future and would have to live with the vise until my next workbench build.
Would love to know your thoughts on these points and what your experiences have been with q-r vs. non-qr vises and if the trade-off in a free vise is worth the possible inconvenience. Open to suggestions on how to proceed.
Thanks,
Carlos
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You must be logged in to view attached files.29 January 2014 at 5:01 pm #26818Carlos, I would clean up and install the vise that you have. I have the quick release function and it is nice, but IMHO not worth buying a new vise over. If you are starting a business, then you may want to consider a vise with quick release function though. It does save time.
To clean it I would get a can of engine degreaser and follow the directions. Then give it the once over with 0000 steel wool. Maybe paint the jaws. Then oil and lubricate, install and put it to work.
That looks like a nice, solid vise you have. It would serve you well for many years to come.
29 January 2014 at 5:20 pm #26822Thank you Greg, you make some solid points. I do plan on fine furniture making as an add-on business, but since my workspace is still in its infancy, production won’t be affected all that much either way…I think I will go with the old vise.
Thanks also for the clean up tips. I have heard some talk about an automotive product called Zeps Big orange as good for removing grease. But I have no experience with it. But going with a regular engine degreaser is probably the surest choice.
Best,
Carlos
29 January 2014 at 5:40 pm #26826great find Carlos clean it, mount it, and enjoy it, i bet you will get years of work out of it,as Greg said i do have a QR vice because i got it for £10 on ebay.If you feel the need to spend i’m sure you’ll find plenty of other useful tools on Pauls list of essential tools , more power to your elbow 🙂
29 January 2014 at 6:14 pm #26830Carlos I also have a quick release vice that is handy if you are making big changes in the vice opening but I find for small movements I will not use the QR I forget sometimes that it has it, so I would use the vice you have it looks like a nice vice.
If I was cleaning it up I would tend to strip down what I could then clean the rust off with wire brushes and wet and dry emery paper and plenty of elbow grease.I don’t have a QR vice and wish I had one but I wouldn’t spend a lot of money on a QR vice right now. Maybe someday when I have more shop time and could justify the expense. You could list your current vice for sale and if you get a price you’re happy with then upgrade. Just a thought.
Any citrus degreaser should work and be a little less caustic than some of the other types and the Zeps Big orange you mentioned should be like that. I like Simple Green for a lot of shop uses including floating particles off my diamond stones, degreasing, and cleaning saw plates. Just use a stronger solution for degreasing.
Carlos, it really depends on what you want. I’ve never owned a quick release vise so I don’t know first hand how it feels to use one. However I have found that if I wanted a particular tool and settled for something less, I’m reminded every time I use it that I wanted the better tool. Something else to consider. I like my non-quick release vise and it works just fine for what I am doing. And if I were in your position, I’d go with the free one and use the money saved for other things like wood and supplies for my projects.. 🙂
29 January 2014 at 9:49 pm #26839Carlos I have QR vice and it is handy but non essential.
The vice you have looks to be a good one. I would stick with the one you have.29 January 2014 at 10:17 pm #26841Eddy, Tim, David, Sandy, Mark:
Thank you guys for your excellent comments and ideas. You have all managed to convince me to use the vise I got for free (and use the money saved for possibly another needed tool 😀 or wood and supplies for the projects, as Sandy said).
David that is a good observation with regards to the majority of my vise jaw changes most likely not being great as far as size, as least at this juncture in my woodworking.
Eddy – That is a great ebay find you got for yourself..bravo! £10 for a vise! I think that’s unheard of on these shores.
Tim – You’re spot on. Hard to justify the additional expense when all of the points are taken into account. Great alternative idea of cleaning up the one I have and possibly selling it. However, I want to build the bench NOW 😀 and not wait for a buyer!
Carlos
I just degreased a vise and used naphtha, but any solvent would do. Use strong gloves (not just nitrile or latex). For the screw, I just held a thick rag tightly around the screw and rotated the shaft so that the rage moved down like a nut, tacking the grease with it. I completely disassembled the vise for this and think that is the way to go- Easier to clean, and it shows you how the thing works. When done, I lubricated everything with paste wax, working it into the screw with a toothbrush, which is working wonderfully. If you don’t want to use heavy solvents, you can try the degreasers and, even if they don’t take off everything, you could give a final wipe with a solvent, thus avoiding most of the solvent use.
30 January 2014 at 3:51 am #26851Excellent advice, Ed, thanks. I think I’ll probably try ordinary laundry soap/ dishwashing liquid and a brush and submerging it in a deep pail I have in the basement. (I’ll disassemble the vise as you suggested and let the parts soak). If still more cleaning is needed, I’ll move on to either a solvent like naptha/mineral spirits (I happen to have some on hand) or a manufactured engine degreaser. That reminds me, gasoline could be used..I use to use gas to remove grease on a motorcycle when I was younger. As you say, many solvents should work (including water).
I will try to not have to use any of the common cleaning solvents even though I do have both latex and nitrile gloves on hand as the vapors bother me more these days. I also worry about the different substances like benzene and others that you breathe more of in wintertime because of the closed garage. Otherwise, I’d just go outside.
I will use oil and past wax when done. I read on Paul’s blog he uses a paste wax too.
I also may paint the jaw faces per Greg’s idea.
Lots to do before I have that finished bench!
Carlos
Gasoline would work. I used to use that for stripping grease on bicycles. If you use anything water based, just take care you really, really get things dry. When I cleaned my vise, it probably took a total of 1 fluid cup, at most, to do the whole thing. The trick is to just dampen the rag and move to clean sections of the rag. Of course, this was fresh grease.
Remember that, just because a glove keeps your hands dry doesn’t mean it is protecting you. Nitrile and latex are fairly permeable to benzene and I think naphtha and gasoline. Your hands will feel dry, but there is still more exposure than you may want. “Rubberized” household cleaning gloves may be better depending upon their material. It’s worth looking at a glove chart at some point. I think people confuse keeping their hands clean with having a protective barrier. I don’t want to pretend to be an expert on this, but just want to point out that, if one is concerned, it is worth looking at glove charts.
Ed,
Your recommendation to use gasoline for degreasing is probably the most egreciously irresponsible and dangerous statement I’ve seen in years.
DON”T DO IT!
Yeh,Yeh, I know people do it and every year they get a nice trip to their local ICU burn unit, not to mention the toxic vapors.
If you’re going to use a solvent, plain or odorless mineral spirits is a better choice because of the much higher flash point, but still has to be used away from ignition sources and with good ventilation and personal protection devices.
Nitrile gloves aren’t perfect or suitable for all organic solvents, but are probably the best choice for naphtha or mineral spirits ie. the aliphatics.
In addition there are numerous orange oil( d-limonene) water based cleaners which would work great for cleaning the vise.
CraigCraig- Thank you for setting me straight. It is interesting what things we learn or are taught to do, become comfortable with, and no longer think carefully about.
I’ll stand by my suggestion that people look at glove charts and look at what is actually in any given product rather than thinking a blue glove always works.
30 January 2014 at 11:36 pm #26899Growing up I helped my grandfather almost every weekend in his garage. We worked all things mechanical, automobiles, tractors, mowers, ect. He had a 5gal steel bucket that had gasoline in it for washing parts. We also dipped our hands in it at the end of the day to clean them. Never wore gloves. I still can’t believe that is what we did back then. Of course it was also common for the state to spray all of the dirt/gravel roads with used oil in the summer to keep the dust down. The old ways are not always better.
Today I won’t even use a finish on my projects that isn’t nontoxic. Food safe oils, shellac, denatured alcohol, milk paint and wax are all that I use.
There are several items on the market today for cleaning and finishing that are safe for you, your family and the environment. I hope that we all make healthy and safe decisions when it comes to these type of products.
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