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Stanley #12 vs Stanley #80

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  • #626047
    Carlos Mena
    Participant

    I recently stopped by an antique shop and I found a Stanley #80 and a Stanley #12 for an acceptable price. The difference in price is about $10 CAD.

    I was hoping to get Mr Sellers opinion on the #12 scraper plane or a comparison between the #12 and the #80, however I noticed Mr Sellers has not created a video for the #12 scraper plane at all.

    If you could provide me some guidance on the similarities and differences of the planes, pros and cons of each and personal opinions on what would you purchase from a second hand store, I would really appreciate it.

    Thanks,

    Carlos

    #626088
    Sven-Olof Jansson
    Participant

    Can’t provide a direct comparison as I don’t have a #12. However, I prefer my Lie-Nielsen #112 and #85 over my Veritas #80. It’s not so much because of the scraper planes – nominally – take flat shavings, but because I find them easier to work over large surfaces, and easier to sharpen. I have added a micro bevel to the blades, and that’s all.

    Yet again, Mr. P. Sellers gets awesome results from the #80.

    (My better half, whose involvement in woodworking mainly is buying me tools as presents, threw a quick look at this thread and commented that ‘The difference is 68’.)

    Sven-Olof Jansson
    London, UK; Boston, MA

    #626158
    Larry Geib
    Participant

    The tools aren’t the same tool with different handles. How you adjust blade presentation is very different, and people gravitate to one or the other depending on how they grock their use.

    The #80 can best be thought of as a cabinet scraper holder. It only has one angle of blade presentation and adjustment is by flexing the blade like a cabinet scraper. Flexing adjusts both width and depth of cut. How much you turn the edge is the only way to change angle of presentation of the edge. If you can use a cabinet scraper, the #80 has an easy learning curve.

    The 12 variants and the 112 and 212 are more like each other and share the same adjustment method. The blades aren’t flexed, but the angle of presentation can be. Changing the angle also affects depth of cut, as the hinge is higher and behind the blade edge. Tilting the blade forward lowers the blade. The planes can be used with or without turning the edge of the blade, depending on how aggressive you want to be. Lie Neilsen recommends neginners not turn the edge, probably to get more predictable results. A perfectly flat edge can leave edge marks, so I ease the corners a little.

    The #81 and the #85 tools have neither angle nor flex adjustments ( except the #85 has a tiny amount of adjustment of the frog) . You set depth of cut only by how much you lower the blade, and adjust how aggressive the cut is by how much you turn the edge ( or don’t).

    And Veritas makes its scraper planes with both angle and flex adjustments, so they might appeal to both camps. ( or provide so many options they confuse you)

    I personally gravitate to the #80. It’s simple. You don’t have to worry about plane blade edge marks so much (partially offset by slightly scooped cuts) and To my mind, you can adjust the cut more easily with just one adjustment screw. The two thumb wheels in opposition on the #12 family are a little harder to set. I have seen people replace the interior thumbscrew with a spring, and that seems to work.( you run that thumbwheel all the way forward and fill the gap with a strong spring)

    If you do decide on the #12, be sure to check the castings around the hinge points. That’s usually where damage and repairs show up.

    #626546
    Carlos Mena
    Participant

    Thank you both, Sven and Larry, for your responses. I am leaning towards the Stanley #80 after reading larry’s post. In fact, I am thinking on buying a brand new Veritas cabinet scraper (Veritas version of the Stanley #80).

    I will add the Veritas cabinet scraper to my Christmas wish list and hopefully my wife gets it for me. Otherwise I will need to buy it in January.

    As a side note, I went back to the antique store and I found out the Stanley #12 had a weld on one side of the plane. That left me with a bad feeling and it also made me questioning whether I wanted to buy the Stanley #80 from that store.

    #626552
    Larry Geib
    Participant

    Repaired 12’s and their kin are fairly common. If the repair is good, you are just getting a plane a little cheaper. That’s probably why the price seemed good. I don’t see it as a reflection on the vendor. That assumption in the used tool world is you are educated enough to tell what you are buying, as long as there isn’t an obvious attempt to conceal the damage.

    And some types break more than others. I rarely see a Stanley #10 that hasn’t been repaired. Some are quite good and the planes work fine. If they aren’t broken, they are what I call collector chum. The prices skyrocket.

    The only advantage I see for the Veritas version is that they are malleable iron, and not just cast iron (it’s been stress relieved.)

    There is a Stanley #80m, which is also malleable iron. I think they were developed for trade schools. They will have 80M on the casting. I see online listings ( one today) claiming a plane is maleable when they don’t have the M. ( seepicture) don’t let a vendor tell you the plane is maleable if it doesn’t have the M.

    But you aren’t supposed to drop the things anyway

    Attachments:
    #626554
    Larry Geib
    Participant

    Repaired 12’s and their kin are fairly common. If the repair is good, you are just getting a plane a little cheaper. That’s probably why the price seemed good. I don’t see it as a reflection on the vendor. That assumption in the used tool world is you are educated enough to tell what you are buying, as long as there isn’t an obvious attempt to conceal the damage. That’s why I told you to check.

    And some types break more than others. I rarely see a Stanley #10 that hasn’t been repaired. Some repairs are quite good and the planes work fine. If they aren’t broken, they are what I call collector chum. The prices skyrocket.

    My #7 is a repaired plane. You can barely tell, I did have a monster flattening job as the sole looked like a banana.
    I got it for $5 and I put maybe 4 hrs into it. I told the guy I wanted the brass adjuster wheel.
    The down side is I had to find another adjuster wheel anyway for my other plane.

    The only advantage I see for the Veritas version is that they are malleable iron, and not just cast iron (it’s been stress relieved.)

    There is a Stanley #80m, which is also malleable iron. I think they were developed for trade schools. They will have 80M on the casting. I see online listings ( one today) claiming a plane is maleable when they don’t have the M. ( see picture) don’t let a vendor tell you the plane is maleable if it doesn’t have the M.

    But you aren’t supposed to drop the things anyway

    • This reply was modified 1 week, 2 days ago by Larry Geib.
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