Stanley No. 4 – what am I doing wrong?
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@kirsty , thanks for the video. You’re making good progress, but there are a few things I’d change. The most important one is that, when you take the burr off the back, you want the blade to be dead flat on the abrasive. At a little after 4 minutes in the video, you take the burr off with the blade lifted up off of the paper, just the tip in contact. This puts a back bevel on the blade, which can be useful for a plane iron at times, but isn’t something you want on a chisel. I’d not put it on your plane irons either at this point.
When using a jig, I think the easiest way to get the burr off is to put the paper on the tile with the long edge parallel to the edge of the tile and right at the very edge of the tile. This lets you put the blade dead flat on the paper and either move in and out with short motions or move side to side in long motions. If you are happy with the short motions (and they would be fine), then you can keep the paper crosswise, like you have it, but make sure the paper comes right up to the edge so that you can reach it. Note that the eclipse jig stays on the blade and just hangs over the edge.
I think you’ll see that the tape is getting in your way, so the spray adhesive would be better. As someone else pointed out, you can see the paper billowing up ahead of the blade because it isn’t glued. This is what quickly causes the edge to round over. It’s not a problem when working the bevel, usually, but it is a problem when working the back. So, I’d get this ironed out before flattening your backs. You can keep sharpening, but my suggestion is to only do drawing motions when removing the burr, never pushing motions, until you get the paper dead flat and stable on the tile.
The next thing I’d suggest is that I can see a lot of stress on your fingers. Rather than working with one hand, try working with two. I curl my fingers under the blade up above the Eclipse jig and put my two thumbs down safely near the edge. Now, the work is shared by two thumbs. I also like to have the jig right in front of me rather than off to the side. Finally, rather than making short strokes, I make long strokes, as long as I can fit on the paper. If you lengthen the strokes, I think you’ll find it goes faster. When you find it goes faster, I think you’ll also find you don’t need as much pressure. This will add up to happier hands. (As an aside, when I work freehand, the tool is more off to the side, like you’re doing here, but with a jig, it’s right in front. Everyone finds their favorite style).
To work two handed, you need to find a way to immobilize your tile. A bit of shelf liner will do it. Or, tape it to a board and clamp the board to the counter. By the way, that nice, white counter top is in real danger of scratching from the tile and turning black from the swarf. You can decide if you care. If so, you can figure out a way to guard against it, I’m sure.
If you have a scrap of wood an inch or two wide and a few inches long, get your blade set up in the jig, then hold the scrap under the blade and pushed up against the jig. Now trace a pencil line across your blade onto the scrap. Now, you don’t need to measure any more. Just use that scrap and pencil line.
Regarding the chisels, the manufacturer’s lapping / grinding marks are quite visible, so they ought to be flattened. Nevertheless, I stay with my earlier suggestion, which is to get more sharpening experience before you flatten them. If you try to do it with the billowing sandpaper, I think you’ll have some issues. You’ll be able to get sharp enough anyway for making a workbench, especially since so much is mortising at this point, so keep going. Get some spray adhesive. (-:
Dean has a nice photo, but be aware that you can’t always see a burr like that. Often, you can only feel them. I try to make the smallest burr I can feel. It’s less work. That’s for another day…for now just do anything that makes a burr.
Keep going. You’re doing well!
Oh yeah, when you take the chip breaker off or put it on, do it in a way that it doesn’t touch the edge. Watch Paul…you’ll see him but it on sideways, drawn all the way back. He then rotates the cap iron onto the back of the blade. It’s still a good cm or so back from the edge. He then slides it up to the edge. If you push it straight off the edge or onto the edge, you can dull what you just sharpened. To take it off, loosen the screw, pull the cap iron straight back (not forward) and rotate it to the side, then remove.
I lied…thumbs are underneath, fingers are on top. Four to six fingers are sharing the pressure rather than just one or two. This is a random spare iron I grabbed and it happens to have a big camber on it and isn’t polished. Ignore that.
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You must be logged in to view attached files.25 September 2018 at 12:59 pm #552261Thanks Sven-Olof, I’ll definitely try the felt pen. One question: when I’m sharpening the chisel, which I started last night using the honing guide set at 30°, should I sharpen the whole bevel? Or do I only need to do 2-3mm up to the tip? I’m not convinced of the accuracy of this cheap honing guide to be honest – I had to fiddle about with it to ensure the chisel was being held straight in the groove on both sides. The Veritas Mk II looks more reliable (and more expensive!)
I’m using redwood for my bench, which I know is pine but that’s about the extent of my knowledge on it. I was guilty of assuming pine is cheap and therefore low quality, but since watching Paul’s videos and starting to do a bit of woodworking, my opinion is changing. I’m amazed at the satisfaction I can get from planing a piece of wood (when it’s not juddering about all over the shop of course) and seeing a silky finish… when I’ve made bits and pieces in the past (and by made I mean sawed and screwed together) I’ve always sanded them down to finish with an electric sander, and how naïve I was to think that was a smooth finish. Anyway, I’ve gone off topic again.
I also assumed tools were sold ‘ready to go’. Obviously not. Thanks for the advice on the jig – I’ve seen a few videos on YouTube and will make one at some point. I did start chopping, with a blunt chisel but still chopping. Here is the progress after about 45 mins. I’ve got some practicing to do before I reach Paul’s “half hour per mortise” suggestion.
I appreciate all the encouragement – as you say Harry, everybody has to start somewhere and I’m sure most people experience their own frustrations along the way. I’ve been planning to start woodworking for quite a while – in fact I bought my chisel set about 3 years ago, then fell pregnant with my little boy and it all got sidelined. I’m just happy to finally be making a start on something. Thanks to everyone that watched the video, now I know I’m not doing anything ridiculous, I’ll get hold of some spray adhesive as has been suggested before until I can get the Eze Lap stones. I think Paul did a video on making a strop, so I’ll have another look at this. My fingers do look a bit strangely contorted so I’ll stand head on and use both hands instead. That should help. I’ll move the paper to the edge as you suggest Ed and ensure the blade is completely flat when taking the burr off the back. The white counter top is possibly not the best place to do this but it’s the only solid surface I have at the moment – in fact that kitchen must be at least 20 years old so we’re replacing it next year. Maybe I should put a few scratches in the worktop just to make sure that happens 😉
Harry, I hadnt seen that video so many thanks for that. Very helpful.
I’m off to buy some spray adhesive!
Kirsty
@kirsty Doing just the tip is fine. As soon as you get a burr, you’re done, even if you’ve only ground or honed just a fraction of a millimeter. Take off as little as you can while still getting a burr. Over time, it will get bigger and bigger and the honing will get slower because there’s more area to abrade, but for now enjoy it.
25 September 2018 at 2:54 pm #552286Hi again Kirsty. Mounting the paper to your tile in a different way would be a good idea and there are several ways. I’ve tried them all and you’ll find one you like. I’ve got one of those guaranteed flat stones and I have good luck just spraying the stone with fluid and plopping the paper down on the wet surface. It sticks for me but that doesn’t seem to work for everyone. Tape is OK but if you tape the paper at both ends, no mater how tight you try to pull it, it wants to gather up on the push stroke. You can tape only one end but then you have to hone in one direction. Spray adhesive is the most reliable bond and also the biggest pain in the neck when you need to replace the paper for all the obvious reasons. Get some Goo Off – that helps. It seems that there are almost as many woodworkers as there are opinions about how to sharpen stuff so try as many of these suggestions as you like and over time you’ll develop methods that suit you best.
I’ve always used a strop and they’re easy to make. Leather is readily available but you need some honing (polishing) compound to charge the strop with and it’s a little harder to find in local stores. You can find it on Amazon and usually, the cheap little sets of buffing wheels for use with an electric drill come with a small bar of the stuff. You might find one of those at the B&Q (Home Depot for me). If you noticed in Paul’s video, he put honing compound directly on a block of wood at first and that will actually do about 90% of what a leather strop will do as long as the block is flat. As far as guides go, I like my Veritas Mark II (others say it’s to complicated) but it’s definitely expensive and the one you have will work. From watching you, I think if you put some silicone shelf liner under the tile to stop it from slipping and fix the paper a better way the only other thing to do will be to eventually get some diamond stones. Keep us posted on the bench. You’ll be a mortise expert by the time you finish that project😃
Harry’s right- clean up requires solvent, but you can minimize this. The trick is to never, ever spray adhesive on the tile. Instead, find a sacrificial bit of cardboard, perhaps the lid of a box, about half a meter square. Put your paper in the middle of this, grit down, and hold the spray can 12 to 18 inches away. Give a quick, light squirt. You’ll barely be putting anything on the paper. Wait 30 seconds or so. You’ll wonder if you really got anything on, but if you touch the back of the paper, it will feel very tacky after 30 to 60 seconds. Just plop this onto your tile. When it comes time to change paper, don’t clean the tile. Some residue will say behind, yes, but it’s fine. Just pull up the fist piece of paper and plop on the new. The old will come up easily because you’ve only sprayed one surface lightly. Eventually, you’ll have the sense that you need to clean. At that point, I use lacquer thinner. Note that both lacquer thinner and goof off are both nasty solvents (they include toluene and xylene, for example). Use the proper gloves. Check the spray adhesive can for a suggested solvent. I only need to clean my granite block a couple times a year, but it’s not my regular sharpening method. My guess is that you’ll only need to clean occasionally.
Now, if you put a good solid coat on both surfaces, let them dry until tacky, and stick them together, it’s going to be much, much harder.
Keep an eye on the paper- You might put more or less adhesive on depending upon whether you are just sharpening vs. doing heavy work on the back of a new chisel.
Once you get your tools flat, you can switch to just wetting the tile if you prefer. It’s heavy work on the back that seems to cause the problems, at least for me.
26 September 2018 at 12:02 am #552318Hej,
As you are already off for spray glue, I’m probably a bit late, but there is spray adhesive that allows repositioning available (London Graphics Centre).A trick to make “permanent” adhesive more willing to yield is to heat the surface the sandpaper is glued to with the heat from a hair dryer (a Baby-Liss will do fine [based on experience]).
/Sven-Olof
26 September 2018 at 3:16 am #552320Sharp fixes 97% of all problems with all woodworking tools.An old saying packed with wisdom. On a bevel down plane the angle (up to about 38-40 degrees) has more effect on durability of the edge. remember the wood shaving is flowing over the top of the blade and has no idea what is going on underneath. The chip breaker can help with very fine shavings if it is set close (.o1o-.o6o”) but makes the plane harder to push. You usually will find that your shaving is accordian like coming out of the mouth. Setting the chip breaker back more than an 1/8″ pretty much eliminates any value from it.Don’t attempt to set the mouth tight and the chip breaker close at the same time, it will just clog and give you trouble. So,sharpen the blade until you feel the burr, set the mouth back to about an 1/8″ gap and set the chip breaker at about a 1/16″ and you should be able to get a general shaving out of it.
26 September 2018 at 3:24 am #552322After thinking about this, if you do not tighten the screw between the chip breaker and the blade tight enough, the blade can get shoved up under the chip breaker and it will do just as you are describing. The chip breaker will be trying to shave the wood and it can’t, so it will bounce on the surface.
26 September 2018 at 1:21 pm #552326I’ve never seen a plane blade be pushed back under the cap iron, but as you say, if the screw in the cap iron that secures the blade is loose, I suppose it would be possible. Kirsty’s problem has apparently been with sharpening and as she has gone about fixing that, the problems are beginning to disappear so I don’t think the cap iron is an issue. It’s a good point to keep in mind though. The cap iron screw doesn’t need to be gorilla-tight, but it should be pretty snug. And Kirsty, if you’re listening, I noticed that you were doing what most of us do and using the lever cap for a screwdriver. It’s easier to tighten the screw if you find a screwdriver that fits. The lever cap is a casting and while it isn’t likely, people have chipped the edge of their lever cap using it that way. That being said, I still use my lever cap when my screwdriver isn’t handy or I’m too lazy to look for it.
@harryawheeler
I actually just had a first experience with this the other day. For some reason I for got to tighten the top iron and cutting iron together.1 October 2018 at 4:10 pm #552398I would nick the corners of the blade of, and buy a cheap Alton honing guide. I had the same problem when sharpening free hand. Then I came with a honing guide and went at 30 degrees. That solved the problem. Hope this helps!
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