Dovetail box bottom advice?
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Hey guys… I’m looking for advice on the best way to make a recessed bottom to a box with through dovetails. I found a few things online about making a rabbet around the inside bottom of the box (which is the way I had imagined it would be done) but they involved using a router bit that was made for this. With hand tools, what is the easiest method? I imagine it could be done with a chisel, but it seems like there should be an easier method with all the tools etc, that we have available to us.
Anyway, thanks for any help you can offer.
Jay,
Whether you use a rebate or groove in which to place the bottom, you will end up with voids in the joint that need to be filled. Paul covers this in one of the box making videos, but I can’t remember which.
This is assuming you’re cutting through dovetails. Half blind dovetails aren’t so problematic. The groove can be buried in the pin recess to be covered by the dovetail.
To avoid the problem you could cut a bottom board to the exact outside dimensions and run a rebate around the perimeter of the board at say 1/2 the board thickness for depth and the width of the box sides. The “fit” is then adjusted in increments, and the bottom glued on.
Best,
Craig
Edit: The photo is of a ceiling tile, but illustrated the idea.Attachments:
You must be logged in to view attached files.Jay, there are two ways, one is the easy way by doing what Craig mentioned, you end up having to plug the holes by wedging a small piece of material into the holes created by the rabbet or plow plane.
The second method is done by cutting a stopped groove or rabbet. Unfortunately this creates a problem when using a plow or rabbet plane because their skates won’t allow the plane to bullnose into the corners. So you end up using a chisel for the most part.
For utilitarian boxes etc I just do the plug the hole method and use the plow plane. For pieces I’m making for gifts and furniture I would use the chisel method.
25 March 2014 at 12:15 am #35069You could build it like a drawer. Groove all of the side pieces, position the dovetails to hide the grooves and the treat the bottom as a raised panel. You go with a traditional bevel edge or simply rebate away the edges of the bottom to fit the groove.
Hope that makes sense.
Thanks for the responses, guys. I appreciate it.
Craig, I have not seen Paul’s video that covers this. It may be in the dovetail box videos, which were before I had signed up for the classes, so I don’t have access.
Greg, in your example would you only be grooving two sides and then sliding the bottom into those grooves?
25 March 2014 at 1:18 am #35099Nope, all four sides. Install the bottom as you assemble the box. The bottom is contained within all four sides and will be able to float a little for expansion and contraction. I’ve seen chest with this type of captured bottom but can’t seem to find an example to link you to.
Jay, the other option I forgot to mention and I’ve used this method which is probably the simplest by far. You could just glue in slips on the bottom edge, say 1/4 inch thick. Cut and mitre them in the corners or you could just butt them together. Then just simply cut the bottom panel to fit and glue it in place. This works well when using plywood bottoms because the bottom won’t move very much, if using a solid wood bottom and the box is larger than say 12 inches wide then you have to take into account wood movement and the bottom groove would probably be the better choice.
[quote quote=35087]
Craig, I have not seen Paul’s video that covers this. It may be in the dovetail box videos, which were before I had signed up for the classes, so I don’t have access.
[/quote]It’s in the sliding top dovetail box video, but if you’re a paying member you can stream it even if the project was before you signed up.
I made a practice piece of about 4x4x4″ with grooved bottom using a plough plane. I closed the gaps with small pieces of wood. I don’t think it’s worth the hassle for small boxes. If you have a larger box which will be used for really heavy stuff, it may be the way to go.
David
In addition to all the good advice, there is another option to consider. Mitred dovetails will not only conceal the grooves, but they also have a very aesthetically pleasing look to the final product.
Regarding stopped grooves made using a plough plane, I remember seeing Christopher Schwarz demonstrates the process in one of his YouTube videos. Not complicated at all, just add a chisel to the equation. I’ll see if I can find it again.
Attachments:
You must be logged in to view attached files.Guys, thanks for all the suggestions. I understand the more simple ones, such as Dave’s suggestion to plug the gaps, etc… but I’m still sorting through the rest. I was able to watch the Roy Underhill episode that Greg linked… he is always fun to watch… still mulling over how to apply dovetails to that process to hide the grooves. I’m interested in finding the Chris Schwarz video that was mentioned.
Hopefully, I can get to work on this soon. Thanks again!
Jay, here is a good explanation of stopped grooves.
http://www.inthewoodshop.com/Furniture/AStoppedGrooveinaDovetailedBox.html
Thanks, Dave… I just found the Chris Schwarz video as well for anyone who is following this and wanted to check it out.
http://www.popularwoodworking.com/video/stopped_grooves_video
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