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Just to follow up on this, I have since bought a Stanley 4.5 smoother on Ebay. Went through the same process to get it set up and didn’t have any of the same problems as I had on the #4. The frog can be moved more than enough forward to close the mouth completely. My suspicion is that the #4 had some inherent problem such as bad casting or holes for frog retaining screws drilled in the wrong place. I reground the blade square which didnt solve the problem of not being able to close the mouth tight (though of course worth doing).
I could follow advice suggested to drill different holes for the screws or not use the frog adjustment screw at all and only use the frog retaining screws. A little disappointed this doesn’t have a better solution but the #4.5 seems very usable for the time being.
One other thing I noticed is that the #4 is blue while the #4.5 is black. Are the blue planes later models and less desirable? Or is it independent of year of manufacture and quality?
I am placing the bevel down.
The blade was definitely not 90 degrees to the body. Not sure if it was that way when I got it or if my beginner’s attempt at freehand sharpening put it that way.
I am trying to regrind to 90 degrees but I don’t have a grinding wheel so it’s been a slow go. I started on an EZE-lap coarse stone but that was taking forever. I think after lapping the bottom of the plane it jumped from coarse to medium/fine. I have switched to 80 grit sandpaper which is making much quicker progress. I’m using a jig this time (Veritas MKII) to try to be sure to get 90 degrees. I set the angle to 30 degrees on the blade, it looked like it was near 30 at the tip and 20 or so higher up the blade (cambered). I’m going to try with 30 degrees across the tip this time to simplify things. I’m almost done and will report back how things look once the blade is square.
I definitely can’t get the frog to extend past the mouth. Sounds like others can? One thing I wonder if the washers I have under the frog retraining screws are too large. This seems to be what is limiting me from from putting the frog further forward. I may try smaller washers (less width) as suggested and see how that goes.
Thanks for all the help everyone, you all have been most generous with your suggestions and advice.
Thanks for all the great responses, it’s been very helpful.
I just measured the mouth opening itself, looks to be about 5.5mm. I don’t see much evidence it’s been filed but if anyone can measure their opening that would be helpful. Does this agree with what a #4 should measure?
I checked my blade for square and it is indeed about 1/32″ out of square, good call. I guess I should go back to using a jig, my hand sharpening is not up to snuff yet. Paul makes it look so easy. 🙂
The frog was not square in the photo, I was being a bit sloppy in putting things back together to get the pictures taken. When I had the frog square though I still had the same problem.
I’m going to try fixing the blade to be square which does seem like it should help and will report back.
Just to be sure I’m not after something that isn’t possible, can others (if they choose to) get their #4 to the point where the blade just starts taking a shaving and with the mouth less than 1/32″ open? And if so, does any part of the frog poke past the mouth opening when removing the blade assembly? Mine gets almost there but stays a bit shy.
Thanks for the helpful replies. Attached are a few more photos in case this helps.
I have taken the plane apart completely and don’t see anything broken or suspicious to my untrained eye. I loosen the frog retaining screws and after doing so the frog moves freely when I turn the frog adjustment screw. I attached an image showing how far forward the frog travels when I turn the adjustment screw to the extreme forward position. The limiting factor is the adjustment screw running out of threads but it does turn freely until then.
I also have an image showing the blade and iron cap, they are very close together, somewhere between 1/16 and 1/32″ apart.
Just in case there are some non-original parts here (I bought this on ebay) I also measured the frog adjustment screw when removed at 2.4cm (15/16″). The mouth itself of the plane body (with no blade present) is somewhere between 3/16″ and 1/4″. The distance from the bottom of lateral adjustment opening on the cap iron to the end of the cap iron (right next to the bevel of the blade) is 9.1cm.
Would a longer frog adjustment screw possibly help? Does the image of the frog’s position seen from above suggest the frog needs to be further forward or does this seem more of a problem with the cap iron’s relationship to the iron?
Thanks for any help!
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